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 Attacker's non-existence in AW: I think I found out why.

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Master Knight DH
Master Knight DH

Number of posts : 149
Age : 33
Registration date : 2007-12-04

Attacker's non-existence in AW: I think I found out why. Empty
PostSubject: Attacker's non-existence in AW: I think I found out why.   Attacker's non-existence in AW: I think I found out why. Icon_minitimeWed Dec 19, 2007 11:26 pm

While checking one of the new screenshots of AW:DoR--the one about the Duster's status screen--I think I figured out why the Attacker got the cut from AW.

In the Japan-only installments, planes could only refuel at airports or on Aircraft Carriers (in the Game Boy Wars series), or via the Supply Plane in Game Boy Wars 3. Outside of GBW3, if a plane got too far from an airport or Aircraft Carrier, it became doomed to crash. No questions asked.

In AW, the cause of a lack of Attacker is probably clear: APCs can refuel anything.

Yep. The removal of the Supply Truck might have been workable, but the simplification of its ability has messed with air forces. By reducing the effort needed to resupply planes, they are far less affected by one of their primary weaknesses: their daily fuel costs. This prevents Attackers from being plausible without making them as costly as they were in Super Famicom Wars. If they were around, they'd get spammed, blast units left and right, and escape cost-effective rape, all while not having much if any problem getting resupplied. Oh, and throw in the occasional Fighter and the extra-occasional Bomber for good measure.

This is part of why the Stealth in AWDS is (situationally) overpowered. It can stay hidden indefinitely when a supplier hangs around and restore its fuel to prevent its crashing. But wait. It can already escape enemy land units via terrain. So it doesn't deserve that ridiculous near-invulnerability. Well, anyway, it can last only 5-8 turns away from an airport without any suppliers, but that's really a non issue because APCs are almost naturally deployed. And Stealth spam is even worse than Attacker spam, obviously; invisibility means having to use a unit's turn to expose the damn thing, plus the opposition actually has to care if the Stealth gets power boosts and IKs because if the Stealth kills the unit then it will no longer be exposed for the Fighter to shoot.

Let's review plane resupplying in each game in the series:
*Famicom Wars - only airports. Of course, planes have a good deal of fuel so they won't go down for a while.
-Survival limit: 7-20 for Fighters (both A and B), 8-20 for Bomber
*Game Boy Wars 1/2/Turbo - airports and Aircraft Carrier. Air units have lower fuel amounts. Fighter B is a VTOL which can use Supply Trucks unlike the other planes.
-Survival limit: 6-16 for Fighter A, 6-14 for Fighter B, 8-18 for Bomber, 8-20 for Radar Transport Plane and Super Missile
*Super Famicom Wars - only airports. Separated because of the Attacker, which makes air units not need to last as long as in FW.
-Survival limit: 8-20 for all planes
*Game Boy Wars 3 - in addition to airports and 2 Aircraft Carriers (by the way, transport rules makes it easier to use air units with the Aircraft Carriers in GBW3), Simple Airports that can be built by Constructors but require a decent deal of Materials to do so; and Supply Plane can resupply Fighters and Attackers except Attacker B, which can use Supply Trucks. Of course, jets have low fuel ratings. (And by the way, helicopters use 3 Fuel per day here. Not a whole lot, but a tidbit to keep it from catching you off guard at the worst times.)
-Survival limit: 5-14 for Fighter A, 4-12 for Fighter B & S and Attacker A, 4-13 for Attacker B, 5-13 for Attacker S, 7-20 for Strategic Bomber, 8-25 for Transport Plane and Supply Plane
*Advance Wars series - well, we know the rules in AW or we wouldn't be here.
-Survival limit: 8-20 for Fighter and Bomber, 6-12 for non-hidden Stealth (AWDS), 5-8 for hidden Stealth (AWDS)

The GBW1/2/T units get the worst of the deal; even though GBW3 has the shortest survival limits for air units, there are more options for refueling air units. FW and SFW don't have Aircraft Carriers, but at least the combat planes there can last for a decent while. Ironically, GBW3 is the least bothersome about the issue without reducing the fuel usage weakness to a minor one (like in the AW series); Simple Airports can be made, but not at a light price, and Supply Planes, while being able to refuel overseas planes, eat up materials and have awful defense that highly guarantee their demise if they're left in the front lines.

And yet in GBW3, the Attacker was around. In fact, there are TWO Attackers that can attack most units. (Attacker S is a bomber. It can't attack air units.) Attacker B is still relatively weak at its job, but is a cheap VTOL. Attacker A can actually deal good damage to plenty of units, but has both weapons being explosive with very limited ammo, in addition to bad defense. Now bad defense alone doesn't really hurt Attackers, since they're air units and can therefore escape being torn up, but it does make them think twice about striking healthy AA walls. However, in order to be balanced well, Attackers still need to have bad supply amounts more than other air units and it needs to affect them.

Comments? Questions? Stupid dog tricks?
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Battle Copter

Number of posts : 622
Age : 27
Registration date : 2007-11-23

Attacker's non-existence in AW: I think I found out why. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Attacker's non-existence in AW: I think I found out why.   Attacker's non-existence in AW: I think I found out why. Icon_minitimeThu Dec 20, 2007 3:43 am

Duster, huh? So-long Stealth, we knew ye as broken. >.<

Terrain abuse is the main reason air units burn fuel in the first place. Can't have em' stalemating forever, huh? Fighters got the worst of it IMO because they move farthest. <.>

Perhaps if Stealths were more expensive they wouldn't be broken. I say 32000. More than underpowered Aircraft Carriers, which are too expensive for what they're worth. Methinks they're worth more like 24000. And since Carriers can't attack sea units it won't be broken in Grit's hands. topic.

They could've kept the Attacker if they made it more expensive. And make their maps with less cities on non-predeployed maps. To stop spamming ya know? You what AW needs? An airport that can't deploy new air units.

As for the Stealths, if they weren't able to attack ANYTHING, maybe just other air units, then they wouldn't be as broken as they are.

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